VIM-22 C-19 Restriction

[K68]

I would like to remind once again, you didn't want to wait for the organizer's decision on  canceltion of VIM22. You decided to postponed the event to next May. We did that, and because the event is not canceled, there is no reason to return the money.
Personally, I'm not happy with that situation my money are blocked too, additionally I will have to repeat same work already done regarding VIM preparation and finally also my VIM partycipation is not obvious.
I hope you are aware that we are not a  travel agencies or travel companies and our involvement in the VIM preparation was completely unpayed.

[geosidecar]

To be honest: that's the reaction I expected!

[SB]

I understand that the postponing VIM for 12 months causes some difficulties for people.

The problem is not VIM or the organisers, the problem is the situation many people find themselves in due to the current virus pandemic.

As Kris correctly notes, each year,  VIM is organised by volunteers who put in a great deal of time and take on a lot of responsibility.
It's difficult moving forward to find people willing to do this. It's rare for people who have helped to organise one VIM to volunteer to do it again.


The Policy for previous VIMs (sometime made clear sometimes unspoken) has always been that once the money was paid it would be very difficult to provide refunds. If this was a problem for attendees they should take out their own insurance.

https://honda-adventure-riders.com/index.php?topic=644.msg7570#msg7570

https://honda-adventure-riders.com/index.php?topic=1723.msg20404#msg20404

https://honda-adventure-riders.com/index.php?topic=767.msg9493#msg9493

https://honda-adventure-riders.com/index.php?topic=419.msg3268#msg3268


If VIM had gone ahead as planned in a few weeks most people would not have been able to attend. I don't believe that situation will change at any time this year.


My own position is that I've had too many messages from people who have lost someone and have not even been able to attend the funeral.
If you're reading this, you're doing OK.

[Two Plugs]

Nothing to add to the last 3 postings. From my point of view the participants fee is obligatory and non-refundable. I am sure that as we get closer to next years date, Kriss and his team will reopening the posibility for new participants. If you cant join and have paid for this years postponed edition, find a Varadero rider who can take your place. Thats the participants responsebility, not that of the orgateam. It never has been the last 22 years.

[ubertourer]

Nothing to add to the last 3 postings. From my point of view the participants fee is obligatory and non-refundable. I am sure that as we get closer to next years date, Kriss and his team will reopening the posibility for new participants. If you cant join and have paid for this years postponed edition, find a Varadero rider who can take your place. Thats the participants responsebility, not that of the orgateam. It never has been the last 22 years.

well, if i dont succumb to covid 19 this year, i will be at the postponed vim next year.

[Snurrepus]

Nothing to add to the last 3 postings. From my point of view the participants fee is obligatory and non-refundable. I am sure that as we get closer to next years date, Kriss and his team will reopening the posibility for new participants. If you cant join and have paid for this years postponed edition, find a Varadero rider who can take your place. Thats the participants responsebility, not that of the orgateam. It never has been the last 22 years.

I totally agree with Bernard and Stewart.
We always had the same (written or unwritten) rules. And it never went wrong, before now.
I know for sure that if the virus had appeared in 2014 just before VIM Geiranger, everybody had lost their money, too.
The (very nice) hotel owner wanted payment a couple of months before the venue, just to be sure to fill up the hotel.
Everybody knew that there were no possibility for a refund.

Our poll also showed that most of the participants voted for a postpone to 2021.
Hopefully the owners don't get bankrupt meanwhile 

[zebulon]

Remember (perhaps for news participants) as non commercial organization we cannot refund any part of your booking in any case ; because of our obligations towards the center

 

Neither if the organisation of an meeting is large scaled or small, its done by private persons. ...We, as 'organizers', are not an commercial enterprise, booking agency or business.
....For questions, special arrangements, etc please contact the orgateam in person of Eric 'snurrepus' and Stewart 'SB' directly.

I know the rules, it never stopped the possibility of "special arrangements" ...but can we consider this year is a normal one ...as for this meeting the rules have changed on some points, not debating about if it is better or not, surely an "evolution" ... as mentioned Orga team is not a commercial enterprise ... and it's on this point I have some strange feelings ...

I would like to remind once again, you didn't want to wait for the organizer's decision on  canceltion of VIM22. You decided to postponed the event to next May.

This message can ask the question who is "the organizer" not the orga team ? strange  if not, have the orgatem subcontracted to a commercial organization ? and then we can consider the problem a little bit differently ...
Just my opinion (and end of the discussion) 

[Snurrepus]

Gilles.

I agree this is some sort of special occasion.
The very special is that we could book a hotel close to the Myczkowianka.
However - we paid directly to the Myczkowianka instead of to Kris' personal account.
Myczkowianka have offered us to postpone to 2021. We (most of us) agreed.
Myczkowianka is responsible for the arrangements for this VIM for Kris and Bogdan - next year.

My first VIM was in Zams in 2010.
As far as I remember, we all paid to Karinda's account.
But - all the arrangements during that VIM was made by the hotel owner, and it was a success.
I'm sure that this year's VIM would have been successfull, too.
And i'm sure that the postponed VIM also will be a success.

The fact that we paid directly to Myczkowianka, is a bagatelle.
And to repeat myself - If the pandemic had occured a few weeks before VIM Geiranger, your money had been lost.
Even if all of you paid to my personal bank or PayPal account.